honest question to the Sox fans / detractors here...

you are theo or any other GM. You have a team....this exact situation presents itself. What do you do? Stand pat out of loyalty? Make the move understanding how it looks / what it is to the outside?

I'm a cubs fan...so admittedly biased. If someone came to me yesterday, today, or tomorrow and said pick one to manage your team....Ricky Renteria or Joe Maddon? I would take Maddon.

Now...no one wants to hear this because its a bit personal...but I have been in business a long time. I have had to make tough decisions and unpopular decisions. Let good people go because of a variety of circumstances. I knew their spouses and kids...it sucked, but they were true & ethical business decisions.

Ricky did nothing wrong...but to me, that is no reason not to try and improve your company or your business or your ballclub.

If the Sox did this...and Robin was out and Maddon was in...same circumstances...what would your honest reaction be?? Don't answer that because I really don't care.

Go Cubs!

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Proud to be UNVERIFIED.

Do you really think they give a shit about some reasoned explanation?

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Nope.

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Proud to be UNVERIFIED.

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Sex isn't dirty, sex isn't a crime. It's a loving act between two or more consenting adults.

-Hank Kingsley

Ricketts is emulating Sterinbrenner

The Boss won titles.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I expect Ricketts will eclipse George's 7

Now you speaking my language.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Our resident Ronnie Woo Woo, Kirkwood, is not going to like this.

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Both teams have similar payrolls and both teams trade away their best players.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

They would be screaming from the mountain top about what a good idea it was and any Cub fan who dared to question it would be called jealous and asked why our Messiah Theo didn't do it first.

But instead we get 18 threads about how this isn't fair to Ricky.

A key difference being that Robin is a fucking idiot and Ricky seems to be fairly competent.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I have been very clear about this: you fire Renteria before making any overtures.

What would have been lost if they fired Renteria? The open dealings with Maddon had already undermined the relationship between the Cubs and Renteria. Bringing him back, while available, would no longer have been a very good option. He was obviously not very valuable to the organization anyway. They viewed him as just a guy.

If they fired him immediately, it would have been understood as just business. Openly courting Maddon while retaining Renteria damaged the esteem is which Renteria, Maddon and the Cubs organization are held throughout baseball. They publicly stripped a man of his dignity.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

my honest reaction would be a muted, "yea, we got a new manager. I'm not going to pretend it marks a sea change in the Sox chances of winning ANOTHER world series." I would then yell out "2005!" and walk away laughing at you.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Robin should be fired no matter what. Then, we should find a new manager.

This is the major difference that Cubs fans constantly want to change the discussion away from. They were very happy with Ricky. They may not have thought he was the answer for the next 15 years but he was the answer for next year.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

If you've been convinced to cheer for three years of horrid losses, then convinced to cheer for just "potential"(again), then convinced to have massive faith in a smoke & mirrors plan that is a bit outdated given the current rules, then convinced to agree that it's in the best(& ethical) interests of "your" franchise to summarily break contracts with "business partners", then convinced that it's ok for "your" franchise to be completely unethical in its dealings with it's own employees, congratulations & have at it.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

And Maddon probably would have been available next year.

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Please don't make Tall Midget embarrassed to be a Sox Fan.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down to get it!

Well said. The funny thing is hearing people say that signing Maddon means "it's time" for the Cubs. As if this was a Phil Jackson scenario of taking the Bulls from point B to C. The Cubs are barely past point A.

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It is time for the Cubs to at least compete. 85 wins at least has you in the discussion for the WC most of the year. With the young (supposed can't miss) talent the Cubs have, the manager, and the $ that is off the books so they can spend at least some in free agency this year, there is no more time for tank losses. Compete this year, and be frontrunners for the division next year. Other than just a ton of injuries, there is no reason for this not to happen.

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It's clear that the Sox fans who loathe the Cubs group is not thrilled with the Maddon hire

Okay, they wanted Maddon, great. But I've heard time and time again from Epstein (and his media lackeys like bernstein) that progress isn't linear. So let's say they do win 83-85 games and just miss a Wild Card. Maddon will be a hero for the moment. But what if they regress slightly in 2017? Is Maddon on the chopping block? I don't know, but that would be a togh spot for Epstein to be in. If you had just kept Renteria (or Sveum) and gotten through the development of these youngs guys, maybe you win with them, and if not, you could have made the splashy move for the big manager if you wanted to. But maybe Epstein is more confident in where the Cubs are than I am.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down to get it!

I don't think that's true. I don't think Maddon is going to make a difference either way. I think BRick and dolphin believe he might help a little bit.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down to get it!

I'm about as thrilled as I was for the Dusty, Lou, Dale or Ricky hires. I really don't care, somehow & in each instance the Cubs are gonna Cub anyway.

I just am amazed that more haven't come to this reality yet.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

I was referring to you and Reader specifically.

I believe both of you would criticize the Cubs for curing cancer

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Hawaii (fuck) You

If they caused the Cancer, they get no points for curing the Cancer.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

How would curing cancer get them closer to winning the World Series?

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Hawaii (fuck) You